Some of the replies here validate my opinion that software development has an unnecessarily high opinion of itself. Software development is mostly a blue collar job which is ruined by those who think of it as a high science. Our industry would be a lot better off - and a lot better at what it does - if it embraced the blue collar nature of our work and educated and organised itself accordingly. Also, snobbery. The number of people who assumed that mechanics don’t do physics and then wrongly assume I meant programmers don’t do math…
fj
 @fjzeit
Oct 31
A programmer uses math in the same way a car mechanic uses physics.

Nov 1, 2025 · 1:09 AM UTC

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Replying to @fjzeit
Mechanics is underrated. My dad was a big rig mechanic. Barely graduated high school, was almost completely deaf, but could diagnose an engine from vibrations and maybe a wrench to his ear like a stethoscope. Total genius where his obsession was. I think you might be right.
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Very underrated.
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Replying to @fjzeit
Yes, blue collar when you do mainly CRUD. It's very difficult to find people who are not blue collar programmers. It's a real pain. Unfortunately, we have no choice, because data transformation at scale requires a very different thinking than a management website. It's something that fly over the head of all and every developer describing their job as "blue collar". Just remember that there is a world beyond what you do. Maybe invisible and inaccessible, but it still exists. We need people and the pool is mince.
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What do you think I do? What assumptions have you made?
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Replying to @fjzeit
this is the gayest debate ever, it's way gayer than the programming language wars rust vs C/CPP shit recently. this is so dumb who cares
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It’s only a debate because dumb noob cunts turned it into a debate. It’s a statement of fact otherwise.
Replying to @fjzeit
I just write some code to change pixel colors on the screen.
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Applied math. :)
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Replying to @fjzeit
I would not go so far as to call it blue collar. It's more like accounting, in that there is a wide range of skill levels. The accountant for the local church is not the same as the CFO of a fortune 500. Same for software development.
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Yes. Hence the need for better organisation. That starts with recognising the “blue collar” aspect of a lot of our work.
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Replying to @fjzeit
There is a difference between a web dev and a firmware engineer for a rocket.
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There are many differences in the industry. Problem domains demands problem domain knowledge. Generalisations are general.
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Replying to @fjzeit
It stopped working when we lost the duality of man (or woman), the man of antiquity. the Seneca stoic
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GIF
What's the gif?
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Replying to @fjzeit
It's almost as though you have to be perceived as irrelevant by the mainstream (the bandwagoners!) to be able to write the code you love. I've felt against the grain for almost all of my 30 years doing it because I've avoided every major framework, library, and trend. Except AI.
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Staying in the groove can be challenging. I have been known to plonk my arse into an unsuitable role just to ride it out until something interesting comes along.
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Replying to @fjzeit
Computers used to be people!
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Yes!
Replying to @fjzeit
Can you elaborate more about how software development is a blue collar job? Nothing wrong with that, but I don't see how.
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We design and build things and then ship them. We work in construction, often in a factory context, our output is expected to operate like a machine. A lot of our functions involve the sort of functions you’d find in manufacturing: inventory, design, construction, quality assurance, maintenance. We strive to build interacting components, to minimise the number of parts. We train to use tools, we optimise, we measure, we adjust. The most effective teams I have ever worked with have a very blue collar mentality to their work. The least effective an intellectual mentality. It is an opinion. It’s ok if you disagree.
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Replying to @fjzeit
As an ex mechanic now dev your analogy is pretty solid. Though dev is a much better class of drunks.
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Replying to @fjzeit
I recently read a statement that better code is written by those who are highly adept at language vs mathematics. In my general experience, this is true. Math, even though I am good at it, had nothing to do with being good at writing code. Software devs are basically essay writers. Which makes the "learn to code" meme put against journalists losing their jobs an extra juicy irony.
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Replying to @fjzeit
Bjarne would agree, I think.
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Replying to @fjzeit
Those folks exist in all walks of life, not really limited to sw
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Replying to @fjzeit
am i the only one who understood what you meant, right off the bat? the lack of inference skills amongst the community is honestly astounding. critical thinking, derivative answers.... yah that doesn't exist anymore. just parrots.
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Replying to @fjzeit
Takes a scientist to be a programmer, setup an experiment, with a hypothesis of the outcome. Usually driven by curiosity, you march onward testing as you go and if it works you add it to the tech debt cuz the next bug/outage/federally mandated a11y needs fixing. Ya you’re right.
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Replying to @fjzeit
AGREE, we are glorified digital journeymen
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